INTERVIEW | In this second part of the interview, ES Shankar, author of the provocative ‘Murdered in Malaysia: The Altantuya Story’, says he is on the mission to find out who allegedly ordered the killing of the Mongolian national. Read part 1 here.

Thayaparan: In an online interview, you acknowledged that you had no first-hand sources for this book and merely relied on internet sources. In this era of fake news, isn’t it dangerous since people who support the thesis of your book consider it a kind of reportage?

Shankar: The vast majority of murder convictions are based on corroborated, reliable circumstantial evidence and testimony from experts. Such convictions are not rendered “fake” because the killer was not caught with smoking gun in hand, which rarely happens in real life. So too with my book. That bit about “internet sources” was a slip-up somewhere and needs to be corrected. Many people I contacted would not be identified, quoted or speak up for fear of state retaliation.

The main actors were unreachable and with so many people from government being involved in this historic C4 murder case, you could hardly expect anyone to turn ‘Deep Throat’. The ‘dedak’ factor coupled with genuine fear meant that I had to go to other reliable sources, including reports in the New Straits Times, Star, and The Sun, etc. There is today, no other book that examines the A to Z of the Altantuya murder like mine. It sets out, besides the murder details and timeline:

a. The background to the murder involving similar Scorpene scandals involving DCNS, France, and multiple murders in Pakistan and Taiwan. Caretaker prime minister Najib Razak knew who he was getting into bed with when he signed the RM7.5 billion Scorpene contract.
b. Testimony of practically every witness in the 662 days of trial from June 2007 to April 2009.
c. Personal details/history of the principal characters like Altantuya Shaariibuu, Azilah Hadri, Sirul Azhar Umar, Abdul Razak Baginda (photo), P Balasubramaniam, and Deepak Jaikishan.

d. Events not known to the general public like the alleged planting of evidence, alleged setting-up of Sirul, the RM100 million Raja Ropiaah Puspahanas Defence Center scandal, Deepak being raided by the IRB/BNM (Inland Revenue Board/Bank Negara Malaysia), etc.
e. Details of published confessions, statutory declarations, court verdicts, etc, which are not easily accessible to ordinary people.

A researcher or student would be happy with my book because, other than my final Emile Zolaesque opinion on the murder cover-up, the rest is based substantially on facts. I challenge anyone to dispute them.

Do you think that this book muddies the waters when it comes to the unsolved murder of Altantuya?

How could it possibly muddy anything? You need as much of the facts you can possibly gather, in order to get the small and big picture. This is the only way to get at the truth. If our government absolutely refuses to find out who allegedly gave the orders to kill Altantuya, it’s our duty to push that government or change it, come hell or high water. What kind of government is it that will allow a convicted killer to go to Australia, and then do nothing to extradite him for over two years?

Would you want a Pakatan Harapan government to consider the murder a high priority should they come into power and if so, why has Harapan been muted when it comes to this issue?

Harapan’s highest priority would be to address the precarious economy and set straight the battered and bruised separation of powers among the executive (prime minister), parliament and judiciary. There is also the issue of sackings of top civil servants who have conspired to cover up corruption and fraud.

Harapan has not been muted on the Altantuya murder. In fact, Mahathir Mohamad resurrected that issue and Najib’s accountability before wading in on 1MDB. Besides me, opposition leaders Anwar Ibrahim, Rafizi Ramli and Tony Pua have all kept this issue alive, as well as blogger Hussein Abdul Hamid aka Steadyaku47 in Australia.

You are claiming what many people think about the Altantuya murder. Does this give you some courage to speak out or does it sadden you that very few people will come out from behind anonymity and speak out?

I was primarily motivated by my own sense of outrage and disgust. Cricket has given us a saying: “Cometh the hour, cometh the man!” But it’s not like I set myself out as some peoples’ champion or something. But equally, Altantuya’s part-solved murder is not a matter I could just let go. Public apathy is generally very high in Malaysia. Everybody was too busy making money in the 80s, 90s and 2000s and ignored human rights, open racism and religious bigotry and the rise of absolute state power. Now it has come back to bite us in our hindquarters.

We know who’s responsible for that. It looks like he’s realised the error of his bumiputera and Islam overkill and is prepared to make proper amends. People are beginning to understand that either you speak out or emigrate. I can feel the pulse of change in Facebook, Twitter and blogs. So, regardless of what’s happened, there’s hope yet.

If the murder was carried out by the cabal you claim, and it was covered up, to what do you attribute the lack of interests by international hegemons in pursuing this as they have done with other kleptocratic regimes?

Kleptocracy is only a secondary issue in the Altantuya murder. For sure, money, as much as RM600 million, if not more, changed hand up and down the country, in the corridors of government and power and in Hong Kong and France. The international human rights bodies have not forgotten Altantuya. The Scorpene bribery issue is in the French courts. Cynthia Gabriel and her (C4) organisation are keeping tabs on that. Razak Baginda has been summoned in France.

Locally, PI Bala’s widow, Santamil Selvi, is pursuing her civil action against Najib and his two brothers, Rosmah, Deepak and lawyer Cecil Abraham and his son. Once again, lawyer Muhammad Shafee Abdullah has emerged from the shadows to claim he represents Deepak who has apparently disputed it. Do remember that Shafee first represented Razak Baginda in the Altantuya hearings before Wong Khian Kheong emerged? Shafee’s highly controversial SMS to Najib when Razak Baginda was arrested have not been denied by either party. Altantuya’s father’s (Dr Setev Shaariibuu, photo) civil suit against Najib, the AG (attorney-general), IGP (inspector-general of police) and PDRM (Royal Malaysian Police) is waiting in the wings.

So, slowly but surely progress is being made. We’ll get there for sure. If Harapan forms the new government, then an impetus to solve this case with final closure will be given to a royal commission of inquiry. There is no other way the truth will emerge of its own accord from Najib and/or his Umno/BN government.

Do you see a pattern when it comes to the state with this murder and others, such as deaths in custody, police shootouts and of course, deaths such as that of Teoh Beng Hock? Do you see a culture as opposed to something else?

In my mind, it is clear that what we are witnessing, if unchecked, is a classic pattern of the evolution of an eventual dictatorship and police state. There is an incestuous relationship between the executive, the police and a cowed and emasculated judiciary, all fired by ‘ketuanism’. This is how Hitler, the Nazis and the SS/Gestapo came to power and triumphed for a few years. So, thousands of deaths in custody and possibly extrajudicial killings remain unsolved because the executive does not force the authorities to carry out mandatory inquests. The executive cannot exert its authority because it needs rogue elements in the police force and judiciary to do its dirty work, which in turn compromises their own position.

Why is corruption rampant at epidemic levels? Because those at the top allegedly steal massively. And those a little below with power in their hands, are not going to wait till 55 or 60 to have a jolly life. So, it becomes self-sustaining and eventually, out of control like a runaway train. Yes, dishonesty, wrongdoing and covering it up has become a culture within the ruling party. How else could a prime minister get away with claiming RM2.6 billion allegedly stolen from a state-owned company was a donation or that he did not know who transferred RM42 million into his personal bank account from another state-owned company, but spent it anyway?

How could 1MDB pretend no fraud took place or that billions of ringgit are missing, with Najib unconstitutionally classify the Auditor-General’s Report on 1MDB under OSA and produce no audited accounts for three years? The MACC chief officer who was at the heart of Teoh Beng Hock’s death got promoted. Najib’s promise that “no stone will be left unturned in finding his killer” has been more honoured in the breach than in the observance. Our only consolation is that history tells us that these dictatorships and police states are doomed to fall.

Writer’s epilogue: Will Malaysians ever discover those who allegedly ordered the killing of Altantuya? Those behind the death of Teoh Beng Hock? The men who have died while in custody of the state security apparatus? I have no idea.